Jumper T8SG - First TX stock running on Deviation

dc59
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20 Sep 2017 09:19 - 20 Sep 2017 09:20 #64542 by dc59

Replied by dc59 on topic New TX from Banggood

vlad_vy wrote: dc59, what version of DfuSe USB Upgrade do you use for T8SG?

Walkera Dfuse USB Upgrade Tools 2.31

Edit : Windows 10 64bit OS on my Acer swift 3 notebook.

Last edit: 20 Sep 2017 09:20 by dc59.

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min54522
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20 Sep 2017 11:17 #64544 by min54522

Replied by min54522 on topic New TX from Banggood

dc59 wrote:
min54522 wrote: Currently the Devo 7E is well recognized by the walkera tool, but the T8SG is not recognized. I have also tried to install a new window.
The only way to survive is to try Linux?

Did you try different USB port on your PC or Notebook?

The T8SG just upgraded the firmware.
1. Win10 RS2 ---> Win10 RS1 x86
2. DevoDfuSe + V2.0
3. DFU USBDrv Installer-1.1
4. Install Walkera USB driver
5. deviation-t8sg-v5.x.x-2017-09-20
The firmware upgrade is great.
The first one is changed to Win10 RS2 -> Win10 RS1.
"EXT + Power on" After upgrading the black screen, I copied the files after usb format and it was done successfully. Thank you for your reply and interest.

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mwm
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20 Sep 2017 17:43 #64548 by mwm

Replied by mwm on topic New TX from Banggood

While parsing hardware.ini to get enough info to display a USB logo doesn't help if we don't have a file system, in this case the problem it would fix - inverting the display - is sufficiently trivial that we can live with it. If it means one less build target, I'd say it was worth it. Might even make this one the default, and have the U7E (which I expect to be a lot less popular) be the one that needs the tweak.

Could somebody who has one of these - or the specs - please add a hardware description page to the Wiki? Possibly it's just the Ultimate 7E, but we don't have a page for that, either.

Do not ask me questions via PM. Ask in the forums, where I'll answer if I can.

My remotely piloted vehicle ("drone") is a yacht.

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dc59
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21 Sep 2017 00:06 #64555 by dc59

Replied by dc59 on topic New TX from Banggood

vlad_vy wrote: Now T8SG target doesn't contain any code, only definitions and makefile, the same approach as for devof-XMS targets.
dc59, can you test this build?

I works fine as 9-19 build, no problem!

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vlad_vy
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21 Sep 2017 04:32 - 21 Sep 2017 12:55 #64556 by vlad_vy

Replied by vlad_vy on topic New TX from Banggood

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Last edit: 21 Sep 2017 12:55 by vlad_vy.

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PhracturedBlue
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21 Sep 2017 11:39 - 21 Sep 2017 11:44 #64558 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic New TX from Banggood

vlad_vy wrote: By the way, if Jumper wishes we can enable flash memory chip auto detection for the series Microchip SST25VFxxxB and SST25VFxxxA, ISSI IS25CQxxx, Winbond W25QxxBV. So they can use different flash memory chips, with different capacity, and with slightly modified PCB it can be 150, 200 and 208 mil bodies. But I don't know if it has any sense for Jumper.

For testing only, T8SG with enabled flash memory type auto detection.

Attachment not found

Please don't propose that to them. The safest way for us to distinguish the product will be by a version coded in the bootloader. Anything else is fraught with danger.

Edit: I think I completely missed the point. On re-reading, I think you may be advocating that they can use arbitrary memory chips, not that we should use the memory chip as a designator for different models. I don't have any issue with that, but I also don't really see a need to do so. Having more variation within the same product leads to more problems in general. Let's not bend over backwards to make it easier for them to make our life more difficult.

Last edit: 21 Sep 2017 11:44 by PhracturedBlue.

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vlad_vy
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21 Sep 2017 12:56 #64559 by vlad_vy

Replied by vlad_vy on topic New TX from Banggood

Ok, I don't see any need for that.

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Moeder
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21 Sep 2017 17:54 #64563 by Moeder

Replied by Moeder on topic New TX from Banggood

Taking a quick look at the bottom of the PCB it seems clear why it won't run with less than 6V supply: They used a 78M05 linear regulator which has 2 V dropout voltage and run an AMS1117 of the 5V line which needs 1 V differential voltage to supply the 3.3 V line. So depending on the load we'll need a supply voltage of 6.0 to 6.3 V.

Simply replacing the 78M05 with a LDO type (typically 0.2 to 0.5 V dropout) in the same package should probably make it run off 4 x AA.

dc59 wrote:

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Fernandez
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21 Sep 2017 18:20 #64565 by Fernandez

Replied by Fernandez on topic New TX from Banggood

Or use this step/updown and power it from a single lipo cell or 18650.
www.pololu.com/product/2122

And this to charge it:
www.banggood.com/USB-Lithium-Battery-Cha...ection-p-924048.html

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Brainstorm
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21 Sep 2017 20:53 #64572 by Brainstorm

Replied by Brainstorm on topic New TX from Banggood

Fernandez wrote: Or use this step/updown and power it from a single lipo cell or 18650.
www.pololu.com/product/2122

And this to charge it:
www.banggood.com/USB-Lithium-Battery-Cha...ection-p-924048.html

I like this idea, because it's something we can easily hack into v1.0 of this TX.

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ltwvince
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22 Sep 2017 03:57 #64577 by ltwvince

Replied by ltwvince on topic New TX from Banggood

Moeder wrote: Taking a quick look at the bottom of the PCB it seems clear why it won't run with less than 6V supply: They used a 78M05 linear regulator which has 2 V dropout voltage and run an AMS1117 of the 5V line which needs 1 V differential voltage to supply the 3.3 V line. So depending on the load we'll need a supply voltage of 6.0 to 6.3 V.

Simply replacing the 78M05 with a LDO type (typically 0.2 to 0.5 V dropout) in the same package should probably make it run off 4 x AA.

dc59 wrote:

Any idea for the specific regulator we can get for this replacement? I would love to use 4x AA instead of lipo for TX as I have bunch of Eneloop which I generally use for all my TXs.

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ramunas
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22 Sep 2017 07:16 #64584 by ramunas

Replied by ramunas on topic New TX from Banggood

I also like to use eneloops in my Devo 7e. These packs are 5.6v fully charged, 4.8v nominal, and are near depletion at 4.4v. So they are in the vicinity of 5v through their useful range. And the 3.3v regulators can probably handle that range of input. So Walkera doesn't use 5v regulators in their 4x AA transmitters. A while back I checked one of their 8x AA transmitters, where they use a first stage regulator and was surprised that it was not 5v, but something like 4.3v or 4.4v. So in order to allow use of 4x AA and/or higher voltage LiPo's it may be worth considering a switch to bypass the 5v regulator for 4x AA?

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PhracturedBlue
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22 Sep 2017 13:08 - 22 Sep 2017 13:08 #64597 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic New TX from Banggood

Can someone who has one of these check what the 5V is actually used for? why step down to 5V when every chip on the boad only needs 3.3V? do they have seperate regulators for the RF than for the MCU? I was thinking that a high quality 3.3V switching regulator (like I used on the universalTX board) would be sufficient, but maybe there is too much noise on the supply side.

Last edit: 22 Sep 2017 13:08 by PhracturedBlue.

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ajtank
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22 Sep 2017 14:05 - 22 Sep 2017 14:05 #64600 by ajtank

Replied by ajtank on topic New TX from Banggood

PhracturedBlue wrote: Can someone who has one of these check what the 5V is actually used for? why step down to 5V when every chip on the boad only needs 3.3V? do they have seperate regulators for the RF than for the MCU? I was thinking that a high quality 3.3V switching regulator (like I used on the universalTX board) would be sufficient, but maybe there is too much noise on the supply side.

The transmitter is using linear regulators instead of buck converter. As stated by Moeder the 78M05 is cascaded with the AMS1117-3.3 to generate 3.3V. It is too much a burden for the AMS1117-3.3 to take the full battery voltage hence the 78M05.

Last edit: 22 Sep 2017 14:05 by ajtank.

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Moeder
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22 Sep 2017 15:54 - 22 Sep 2017 19:09 #64601 by Moeder

Replied by Moeder on topic New TX from Banggood

A suitable replacement in DPAK could probably be a ST LDFM50 (0.3 V dropout, so with 3.3 V + 1.0 V + 0.3 V = 4.7 V minimum input voltage) or a LF50 (0,45 V dropout). Anything with a higher dropout voltage will be tough with rechargeable AA's. There's also some .23 V dropout regulators from ON (NCP5501DT50). But before advising a suitable replacement I'd like to have a look on the TXs circuit design and power requirements (it will have to supply a dfplayer as well

). My sample is somewhere between China and Europe right now, so please have little patience.

Edit: Replacing AMS1117 with something like MCP1826S would "save" another 500 mV,but they are not pin compatible...
edit 2: found some: TC2117 and ADP3338

Last edit: 22 Sep 2017 19:09 by Moeder.

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ridgerunner
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24 Sep 2017 13:48 #64619 by ridgerunner

Replied by ridgerunner on topic New TX from Banggood

My brand new Jumper T8SG (delivered 2017-09-23) worked for about 1/2 hour then got permanently stuck in USB mode.

Does anyone know if there's a master reset button inside? (I haven't opened up the case until I hear how Banggood handles my failed unit.)

Hoping that Banggood/Jumper will quickly fix the design problem and make this right.

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FDR
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24 Sep 2017 13:49 #64620 by FDR

Replied by FDR on topic New TX from Banggood

Try to remove the battery for an hour, it sometimes helps with the DEVO transmitters...

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PhracturedBlue
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24 Sep 2017 14:24 - 24 Sep 2017 14:25 #64621 by PhracturedBlue

Replied by PhracturedBlue on topic New TX from Banggood

ridgerunner wrote: My brand new Jumper T8SG (delivered 2017-09-23) worked for about 1/2 hour then got permanently stuck in USB mode.

Does anyone know if there's a master reset button inside? (I haven't opened up the case until I hear how Banggood handles my failed unit.)

Hoping that Banggood/Jumper will quickly fix the design problem and make this right.

Have you tried reinstalling the filesystem? If you see the USB logo, it means the filesystem is corrupted. That shouldn't happen, but can theoretically happen if there is a bug in the firmware, and/or the transmitter shuts down improperly. If you don't have access to the USB port then I guess that can't be done without opening it (and as you say, that may be a problem if you want a refund).
The problem with not shutting down was also common on the Devo radios. Maybe Jumper copied Walkera's power circuit (which I never really liked). The issue was caused by a failing switch (Walkera used very cheap switches for the power switch, I would not be surprised if Jumper did the same). The faulty power switch has been known to cause the flash to get wiped as well (d to poor signalling probably). Fixing your radio is probably as simple as replacing the switch with a $1 replacement and reflashing the filesystem, but I can understand you might not want to do that to a brand new radio. The bad switch could also be paired with a bad memory chip, or bad soldering contacts, and those would not be quite as easy to root-cause and repair.

To note, I don't have a Jumper Tx yet, and have not looked closely at the circuit board images in this thread.

Last edit: 24 Sep 2017 14:25 by PhracturedBlue.

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ridgerunner
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24 Sep 2017 14:54 #64622 by ridgerunner

Replied by ridgerunner on topic New TX from Banggood

FDR wrote: Try to remove the battery for an hour, it sometimes helps with the DEVO transmitters...

Thanks for the suggestion, but I tried this (left the battery out overnight).

PhracturedBlue wrote: Have you tried reinstalling the filesystem? ...

Not yet. To get at the USB connector, I'll need to take apart the case and I'd rather not do that until Banggood has told me how to handle any return/refund etc. BTW - how does one reformat the Tx filesystem? Can someone point me to a HOWTO? (Sorry, I'm an OpenTX guy and don't have much experience with Deviation yet.)

PhracturedBlue wrote: ... The problem with not shutting down was also common on the Devo radios. ...

I'm pretty sure its shutting down correctly - the LCD screen turns off after a couple seconds.

If I decide to re-flash, is there an updated firmware file somewhere?

Thanks for all the feedback/help guys!

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SeByDocKy
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24 Sep 2017 16:46 - 24 Sep 2017 16:47 #64625 by SeByDocKy

Replied by SeByDocKy on topic New TX from Banggood

Sorry ... if it's already written in previous posts.... but now can we directly flash the U7E nightly buiild for the Jumper ? No hardware.ini modification ?

Last edit: 24 Sep 2017 16:47 by SeByDocKy.

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